Schall Alien Mutation


Adds laser-resistant aliens, who counter laser turrets. Also adds fire-resistant aliens, who counter flame turrets. They will put some pressure on your base defense. (Locale: English, Deutsch, 正體中文, 简体中文, Русский, Português Brasileiro, Español)

Content
3 years ago
0.16 - 1.1
2.82K
Enemies

i [Responded] Turrets could ignore immune enemies

3 years ago

There's a feature for blacklisting targets on a per-turret basis: https://forums.factorio.com/86164

If you're looking for a refinement project at some point: https://wiki.factorio.com/Types/TriggerTargetMask

Might be a pain to extend that to modded turrets, not sure what the best design structure would be.

3 years ago

Short Answer

Current per-turret basis is insufficient for such use.
Even if per-ammo basis becomes available, it would take tremendous effort to implement, and I do not think it worths the effort.

Long Answer

As you have mentioned, it is "pain in the a$$" to apply on modded turrets.

One immediate counter to this per-turret basis blacklisting, is that the same turret can have different choices of ammo. For example, my rocket turret from Schall Ammo Turrets can shoot both vanilla explosive rockets and my own incendiary rockets. Against ceramics, the former is 100% effective (explosion damage) while the latter does nothing (pure fire damage). Users do not want to waste incendiary rockets on ceramics, but blacklisting rocket turret will also prevent explosive rockets to get the job done.
So blacklist on the per-turret basis is obviously insufficient. It has to be per-ammo basis. Therefore, the current target mask implementation has little use IMO.

And even per-ammo basis would be implemented, the situation is still rather complicated.
First of all, I cannot know the nature of those modded turrets and modded ammo, I cannot judge they should fire or not on the mirror or ceramics mutated aliens.
A good example comes from my own mod Schall Alien Tech. My various particle and plasma shots are dealing mixed electric and fire damage, and I gave them different values of "electric damage to fire damage ratio" (abbreviated as "EFR" below), to reflect their different form of the shots. The particle beam shots are "intense coherent beam" in nature (EFR 1:2). EFR of the particle beam in "mega" form is reduced to 3:5. The particle cannon shots is an "unstable compressed energy ball" which is much energy-inclined (EFR 1:1). The plasma shots are basically highly-densed charged particles (EFR 3:2).
So what should be the borderline here? What critical value of EFR should the turret be blacklisted against the ceramics?

My expectation is all of them should still shoot, even though they have varied effectiveness:
- The plasma shots are only 60% effective (as EFR 3:2) against ceramics, but are still quite good as the base damage is high! Also they will stun the target for a short time. So definitely I will keep firing that on ceramics.
- The particle beam shots are only 33% effective (EFR 1:2), but I think many users would still prefer particle beam turrets to keep shooting as the ammo is very cheap anyway.
- The mega particle beam shots are much more expensive with the low 37.5% effectiveness (EFR 3:5). It may sound a good candidate to blacklist. However, it is dealing massive AoE, and in this game alien forces do not come alone (but in groups). So not much difference in blacklisting or not...

Hence in this single case, not a single turret among them should be blacklisted. And in the above process, you can see it cannot be judged from the fraction of heat damage (against ceramics) alone, but also other considerations (e.g., stun effect, ammo cost, AoE range) that cannot be determined by code automatically.

My conclusion is it would take tremendous effort to support every turret and ammo. It cannot be automatically determined from the turret and ammo prototypes, but has to be handpicked (by authors of each turret and ammo who introduced them...)
Not to say that, the per-ammo basis blacklisting is not yet available.

And actually my prime motivation of this mod, is to encourage users to have a good variety of turret types (or to "punish" those lazy monotonic turret defence of a single type.) If users are already utilizing multiple turret types, applying target blacklisting would not give them much difference anyway.

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