Quality Processing


Quality Processing is an alternative to the vanilla quality system. Produce new upgrade materials in increasingly complex processing chains to combine them with any item in the new upgrade machines for a guaranteed quality upgrade.

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5 days ago
2.0
271
Factorio: Space Age Icon Space Age Mod
Manufacturing

g Balance for quality Science

10 days ago

I tried to do an evaluation to see if it is feasible to make quality (blue) science using this mod.

By upgrading the intermediates and then craft the quality science with the quality ingredients. It seems the additional costs is quite gigantic, which is fine for buildings i guess. would you have suggestions to handle this use case?

Quality Total Cost (Key Resources per Pack) Normalized Total Cost Costs Multiplier Science Value Cost per Science Value
Normal Iron ore: 6, Copper ore: 7.5, Coal: 1.5, Crude oil: 38.46 18.8 1.0 1 100%
Uncommon Iron ore: 133.5, Copper ore: 92.5, Coal: 22.75, Crude oil: 446.46 293.4 15.6 2 778%
Rare Iron ore: 4060.5, Copper ore: 2489.5, Coal: 341.5, Crude oil: 10514.46, Uranium ore: 212.5 8155.4 432.7 3 14425%
Epic Iron ore: 4090.5, Copper ore: 2521.5, Coal: 415.25, Stone: 26.35, Crude oil: 10936.46, Uranium ore: 212.5, Tungsten ore: 17, Holmium ore: 84.25, Scrap: 85, Yumako tree: 79.69, Jellynut: 31.88 8221.1 436.2 4 10906%
Legendary Iron ore: 4130.5, Copper ore: 2561.5, Coal: 499.085, Stone: 47.6, Crude oil: 12358.46, Uranium ore: 212.5, Tungsten ore: 17, Holmium ore: 181.35, Scrap: 170.1, Yumako tree: 159.38, Jellynut: 63.75, Promethium asteroid chunk: 17, Fluoroketone-cold: 51, Lithium brine: 21.28, Ammoniacal solution: 425.5 8388.8 445.1 6 7419%

(Each unit of crude oil counts for 1/10th of the value.)

10 days ago

First, if you use the standard settings, the sublinear growth off complexity->upgrade cost makes it cheaper to upgrade the science pack compared to its ingredients.

I think the core issue of quality science, also in vanilla, is the linear increase of science value with quality while the upgrade cost usually scales stonger than that (exponentially in vanilla). I analyzed that a bit while playing with the Quality Condenser, where a quality% of about 64% is required just to break even for legendary science (6 normal -> 1 legendary which has 6x the science value). But in that case a single upgrade to uncommon still gives the best cost per science value, since normal -> uncommon has the largest relative increase for each upgrade step.

You could try to play around with the settings, for example overriding the complexity of science packs (using the "preset complexity" setting) to some low value to make the upgrade cheaper. But with the way this mod is build with the increasingly complex/expensive upgrade material this might not solve the scaling issue.
Another option for you might be to use mods like https://mods.factorio.com/mod/adjustable-quality to adjust the science value gained by quality.

A more involved option from my side would be a special handling of science pack upgrades that has linear cost. But that might feel cheap: imagine using a normal(!) science pack for each upgrade of said science pack (2 for epic->legendary) which would just result in a constant cost per science value for all quality levels. So to make the upgrade process worthwhile, the upgrade cost of science packs would need to be even cheaper than that.

10 days ago

Hey thanks for your feedback.
and yes i agree directly upgrading science, would feel cheap. I was more looking towards the case, that you upgrade your different intermediates and then craft science with those upgraded parts.

10 days ago

Even if you upgrade the intermediates it would not change the scaling issue, since you still pay the upgrade costs, just at the intermediate stage.

10 days ago

Yes i would probably need to adjust the settings if i would like that, I tried argueing with chatgpt about, but its quite complex. and not sure if i can use factoryplanner to help me calculate.

8 days ago

oooff i just realised i first need to upgrade my upgrade packs haha
Do you have any numbers how the raw costs are, compared to the costs it would take using vanilla methods?

8 days ago

Yes, you have to do that, that's part of the complexity :)
For vanilla, it depends on the item and the setup, as explained here: https://wiki.factorio.com/Quality#Optimal_module_usage

For this mod, the upgrade cost with stardard settings is (10 upgrade materials to upgrade Calibration matrix and Reinforcement package, 11 for Quantum tuner):
1 normal Post processing kit: 1 normal Post processing kit
1 uncommon Calibration matrix: 10 normal Post processing kits, 1 normal Calibration matrix
1 rare Reinforcement package: 110 normal Post processing kits, 10 normal Calibration matrices, 1 normal Reinforcement package
1 epic Quantum tuner: 1331 normal Post processing kits, 121 normal Calibration matrices, 11 normal Reinforcement packages, 1 normal Quantum tuner

If this is too expensive (or too cheap) you can adjust the "upgrade item upgrade cost scale" setting.
For example, with "upgrade item upgrade cost scale" = 0.2 (2 upgrade materials to upgrade each):
1 normal Post processing kit: 1 normal Post processing kit
1 uncommon Calibration matrix: 2 normal Post processing kits, 1 normal Calibration matrix
1 rare Reinforcement package: 6 normal Post processing kits, 2 normal Calibration matrices, 1 normal Reinforcement package
1 epic Quantum tuner: 18 normal Post processing kits, 6 normal Calibration matrices, 2 normal Reinforcement packages, 1 normal Quantum tuner

8 days ago

Making the upgrade materials can be affected by productivity all along the production chain, so the final cost in raw resources also varies based on your setup.

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